If supporting what the people have voted for is wrong, then count me in. That’s called democracy in action. Not giving a hoot what the elitists want is appropriate for votes in Romania. Guess you didn’t like the results, eh?
I am fully against the constitutional court’s decision. It was undemocratic. As stated in other messages, I meant here the support from Kremlin for the fascist paramilitary group, “Vlad the Impaler”.
Had Georgescu been allowed, democracy in Romania would be dead. But that is another story.
LOL the western propaganda press suddenly quit reporting about that ‘Russian influence’ lie when it was proven it was the Romanian liberals who did it.
You should keep up with the lies you parrot.
Oh hey, weird how this wasn’t a problem until Georgescu started running. He was in Romanian politics and even in the government for a long time last I checked, so clearly Romanian regime didn’t have a problem with fascist groups before. And all of a sudden they started caring when it became convenient for them. Seems to me that it’s not fascism that’s the problem for them.
Yes, I fully agree that the government tolerated these fringe groups for too long. There is no excuse for that. They suddenly gained visibility recently, and part of the group of actors involved in that rise in notoriety is Moscow.
Fully agree, sadly Romania has nothing anywhere near anything resembling socialism, corruption is rampant with or without fascists taking center stage. If it’s not American bootlickers in power, it’s so called “suveranists” who would bend over backwards for anyone giving them an edge in local politics.
This is a conversation that went into a different direction and is in no way related to the RT article.
If someone uses RFE, VOA or any other one of those pure propaganda tools that as a source I certainly am going to question them.
There is no reason why I shouldn’t.
Definitely question the source. Even after writing I realized RT is more akin to hollywood propaganda than RFE. On the best of days could we compare RT to AP, I guess.
That leaves my other point standing. I understand we are all people and are emotional about such matters, but you countered the Romanian source with a jab, then drove the point home by attacking their state of mind. An emotional, triggering response to a friggin link. Deepening divide, operating with shame.
Why do you use these tools of shaming when plain truth is on your side? Why did you not go through the romanian sources with a trusted translator service and reply with glaring problems instead of questioning their sobriety?
We are talking about serious stuff in times that can lead to WW3.
I am human and can get emotional about it.
Throwing a ‘source’ at me from RFE, an entity which is universally known as a US propaganda tool could in itself be seen as an insult and questioning my intelligence.
Besides that, my jab in return was quite mild.
Especially considering the vile insult that get thrown at me constantly by others if I dare question the western narrative.
That puts me in a defensive state already.
Regardless of all this I ended the conversation with:
Thanks for listening, and dissagreeing without arguing or insults.
Have a good night.
We ended on good terms, he is OK with it, so should you. You made your point.
I’m supposed to read Romanian now? Did you have too many Ursus or palinka? The only one not in Romanian is the garbage and biased western source AP.
Even that says: “suspected of” and “allegedly”.
The normal tactics to throw accusations WITHOUT any PROOF.
When you’re going to make claims you need proof, not this BS.
This is just made up shit to justify their illegal actions of not honoring the election result by the US puppets.
And there certainly isn’t an ‘admission’
Hi, sorry to butt in on this thread, but this part almost feels malicious:
I’m supposed to read Romanian now?
Especially in an age of automatic translation, this sentence just broadcasts ill intent. While you cannot know what allegances that specific Romanian outlet has, it feels strangely biased you doing all this under a Russia Today article. Also those jabs, man. ‘Did you drink too much?’
Yes, you are supposed to read Romanian if you’re arguing with a Romanian about events happening in their own country.
The made up shit I see so far in this thread is handwaving dismissal of sources without any back up whatsoever. What sources do you present that contradicts what I claimed so far, aside from laughing at sources dismissively?
That is how you reason and make an argument.
Now admit it was the liberals, that they shamelessly blamed the Russians and your vasal state illegaly corrupted the elections.
The proof you provided, I never denied. I am painfully well aware of the liberal psy-op.
My claim: Kremlin agents supported a fascist nationalist group (that also consider Georgescu the real president) called “Vlad Tepes” in a plan to overthrow the government. This is still not refuted by anyone. The only sources I found in English you dismissed out of hand, while the investigation in Romania is still ongoing.
The Soviet Union just after the war supported the so-called “Socialist Imperial Party” in Western Germany, until it was banned there. That party, as you might have guessed, was basically rebranded Nazis.
And yet Kremlin can’t stop from propping up the fascist Legionnaires in Romania “for democracy”.
If supporting what the people have voted for is wrong, then count me in. That’s called democracy in action. Not giving a hoot what the elitists want is appropriate for votes in Romania. Guess you didn’t like the results, eh?
I am fully against the constitutional court’s decision. It was undemocratic. As stated in other messages, I meant here the support from Kremlin for the fascist paramilitary group, “Vlad the Impaler”.
Had Georgescu been allowed, democracy in Romania would be dead. But that is another story.
This is what liberals describe as “whataboutism”.
How so? It’s the same subject, Russia. The same object, fascist ideology. On one side they condemn it, on the other they prop it up.
Had I said a different subject or object, I would have agreed. But here I need you to help me out, I don’t see whataboutsim.
No. The subject is the Latvian SS.
LOL the western propaganda press suddenly quit reporting about that ‘Russian influence’ lie when it was proven it was the Romanian liberals who did it.
You should keep up with the lies you parrot.
I love how you’re getting downvoted for stating factual information that’s been reported in mainstream western media https://www.politico.eu/article/investigation-ties-romanian-liberals-tiktok-campaign-pro-russia-candidate-calin-georgescu/
Never stated Kremlin was the only one backing Georgescu, liberals also had their role to play in this farce. But I meant the “Vlad the Impaler” paramilitary fascist group with direct ties to Moscow https://www.rferl.org/a/romania-vlad-the-impaler-group-russia-coup-plot-treason/33348058.html
Oh hey, weird how this wasn’t a problem until Georgescu started running. He was in Romanian politics and even in the government for a long time last I checked, so clearly Romanian regime didn’t have a problem with fascist groups before. And all of a sudden they started caring when it became convenient for them. Seems to me that it’s not fascism that’s the problem for them.
Yes, I fully agree that the government tolerated these fringe groups for too long. There is no excuse for that. They suddenly gained visibility recently, and part of the group of actors involved in that rise in notoriety is Moscow.
Again, it’s very clear that it’s not fascism that the government takes issue with.
Fully agree, sadly Romania has nothing anywhere near anything resembling socialism, corruption is rampant with or without fascists taking center stage. If it’s not American bootlickers in power, it’s so called “suveranists” who would bend over backwards for anyone giving them an edge in local politics.
Removed by mod
Radio Free Europe?
I’m just not going to comment and let everyone laugh at your source.
You really gonna call sources into question on an RT thread?? Would I be going too far as stating RT is to Russia what RFE is to the US??
This is a conversation that went into a different direction and is in no way related to the RT article.
If someone uses RFE, VOA or any other one of those pure propaganda tools that as a source I certainly am going to question them.
There is no reason why I shouldn’t.
Definitely question the source. Even after writing I realized RT is more akin to hollywood propaganda than RFE. On the best of days could we compare RT to AP, I guess.
That leaves my other point standing. I understand we are all people and are emotional about such matters, but you countered the Romanian source with a jab, then drove the point home by attacking their state of mind. An emotional, triggering response to a friggin link. Deepening divide, operating with shame.
Why do you use these tools of shaming when plain truth is on your side? Why did you not go through the romanian sources with a trusted translator service and reply with glaring problems instead of questioning their sobriety?
We are talking about serious stuff in times that can lead to WW3.
I am human and can get emotional about it.
Throwing a ‘source’ at me from RFE, an entity which is universally known as a US propaganda tool could in itself be seen as an insult and questioning my intelligence.
Besides that, my jab in return was quite mild.
Especially considering the vile insult that get thrown at me constantly by others if I dare question the western narrative.
That puts me in a defensive state already.
Regardless of all this I ended the conversation with:
We ended on good terms, he is OK with it, so should you. You made your point.
AP news: https://apnews.com/article/romania-russia-treason-coup-plot-detain-diicot-437213648450f20031f76b53266ce50c
Wiki in Romanian about the group https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comandamentul_Vlad_Țepeș
Some more Romanian sources: https://newsweek.ro/actualitate/doi-membri-ai-gruparii-vlad-tepes-arestati-alti-patru-lasati-acasa-sub-control-judiciar
https://www.gandul.ro/actualitate/negocierile-dintre-membrii-gruparii-comandamentul-vlad-tepes-si-moscova-in-mai-o-sa-porneasca-agitatie-ce-s-a-vorbit-despre-calin-georgescu-20458493
https://www.stiripesurse.ro/ce-este-si-cand-a-fost-infiintat-comandamentul-vlad-tepes-condus-de-general-in-varsta-de-101-ani-cum-arata-planul-de-reorganizare-al-lui-radu-theodoru_3604855.html
Discredit those too, please
And then, discredit their own admission of the facts while you’re at it: https://www.stiripesurse.ro/prosecutors-release-report-on-getia-treason-case-intercepted-conversation-excerpts-included_3605815.html
I certainly will.
I’m supposed to read Romanian now? Did you have too many Ursus or palinka? The only one not in Romanian is the garbage and biased western source AP.
Even that says: “suspected of” and “allegedly”.
The normal tactics to throw accusations WITHOUT any PROOF.
When you’re going to make claims you need proof, not this BS.
This is just made up shit to justify their illegal actions of not honoring the election result by the US puppets.
And there certainly isn’t an ‘admission’
Hi, sorry to butt in on this thread, but this part almost feels malicious:
Especially in an age of automatic translation, this sentence just broadcasts ill intent. While you cannot know what allegances that specific Romanian outlet has, it feels strangely biased you doing all this under a Russia Today article. Also those jabs, man. ‘Did you drink too much?’
You do notice the article from RT is in English right?
Yes, you are supposed to read Romanian if you’re arguing with a Romanian about events happening in their own country.
The made up shit I see so far in this thread is handwaving dismissal of sources without any back up whatsoever. What sources do you present that contradicts what I claimed so far, aside from laughing at sources dismissively?
Again you have no sources, just allegations.
Sources prove stuff, if not it’s worthless
This is how you do it:
https://www.politico.eu/article/investigation-ties-romanian-liberals-tiktok-campaign-pro-russia-candidate-calin-georgescu/
“The center-right Romanian National Liberal Party paid for a campaign” etc, notice that there’s no alledgedly or suspected?
It gives details
who specifically did it: PNL-employee firm, Kensington Communication
how they did it: The firm paid 130 influencers co-opted on the FameUp platform
All backed up by a declassified document of the CSAT and in a report of the Expert Forum.
https://www.presidency.ro/files/userfiles/Documente CSAT/Document CSAT MAI.pdf
That is how you reason and make an argument.
Now admit it was the liberals, that they shamelessly blamed the Russians and your vasal state illegaly corrupted the elections.
We may be arguing past each other.
The proof you provided, I never denied. I am painfully well aware of the liberal psy-op.
My claim: Kremlin agents supported a fascist nationalist group (that also consider Georgescu the real president) called “Vlad Tepes” in a plan to overthrow the government. This is still not refuted by anyone. The only sources I found in English you dismissed out of hand, while the investigation in Romania is still ongoing.
The Soviet Union just after the war supported the so-called “Socialist Imperial Party” in Western Germany, until it was banned there. That party, as you might have guessed, was basically rebranded Nazis.