Value isn’t necessarily something tangible. It’s what other people think it’s worth. The USD doesn’t have any more value than the belief people put in it. Do you also think it has no value?
I’m not defending crypto speculation, but it’s ignorant to say it doesn’t have value if you can buy things with it. Basically all modern money is based on faith, including crypto. Even when it’s based on gold or silver, that’s aren’t actually useful for most people so it’s still made up value worth however much people value that.
Basically all modern money is based on faith, including crypto.
Ok, sure, however, fiat currencies are based on the faith that there’s at least one entire nation that you can use your currency in, and is motivated to ensure their currency is worth something, and has some semblance of stability. Crypto is based on the faith that there’s other dumbasses out there that will agree with you that these particular bits hold value for some reason.
Crypto is based on the faith that there’s other dumbasses out there that will agree with you
And that’s the most beautiful thing about crypto that got lost in all the speculation, shitcoin, scams, and nft bullshit. A currency of the people for the people, but of course, when the pigs came into power they were the same as the old farmers.
Keep telling yourself that crypto is a scam with no value, etc… While you loyally and unquestionably use your green paper money covered in pictures of slave masters.
Sure. I’m not disagreeing with that, just that it doesn’t have value. It does. Just because it’s made up doesn’t mean it doesn’t have value, as long as someone is willing to buy it from you.
I don’t like these uses of crypto either. It’s just a really stupid argument to say it doesn’t have value. There are plenty of valid arguments that can be made against it without making something up like that.
Right, and I’m not arguing that cryptocurrency doesn’t have value, just that it’s value is based on a much less solid foundation than the value of fiat currency.
Ok I’m talking about fiat currency as a concept though, not the USD specifically.
If your point is that fiat currencies are still vulnerable to some instability, then sure, I guess I agree, but fiat currencies are still orders of magnitude more stable than cryptocurrencies.
If a state converted from paper money to crypto, the only discernible differences would be like more computers, more transparency, less middlemen, etc. Crypto is literally just a new (distributed, open) form of accounting.
I can’t answer for anyone but myself, and I’m not European, but I absolutely trust government more than anonymous obsessive Internet people. At least governments are theoretically held in check by those they govern. Internet randos don’t play by anyone’s rules but their own.
With the current administration, I’d argue we are definitely in “faith based” money right now.
It was originally based on a gold reserve and then taken off to become a fiat currency. Trump is talking about potentially not paying back debts owned to other governments. Definitely sounds faith based to me, there’s nothing hard backing it.
True, but that isn’t contradictory. The point is value of both of these forms of currency are made up and imaginary. They’re valuable as long as someone is willing to purchase it.
The same is true for gold. People think it has intrinsic value, which is why it’s so easy to scam people with. The value is almost entirely based on people thinking it’s valuable though.
I don’t like crypto-currencies. It “not having value” isn’t the correct argument to use against it though. It’s a pretty stupid one. There are plenty of good arguments that should be used instead.
The USA government? With the tariffs? And the orange buffoon in charge? If we’re counting that, then we might as well count his “crypto reserve” as backing too.
Or it could be backed by math and economics alone.
I don’t think it’s worth the discussion, but comparing a fiat currency like the US dollar with crypto currency is a false equivalence argument. They aren’t even comparable.
I didn’t say they’re equivalent. I said both of them have value that is imaginary. Crypto currencies have value if you can purchase things with them. It just makes you sound dumb to say it doesn’t have value. That’s not the correct argument to make against it.
Value isn’t necessarily something tangible. It’s what other people think it’s worth. The USD doesn’t have any more value than the belief people put in it. Do you also think it has no value?
I’m not defending crypto speculation, but it’s ignorant to say it doesn’t have value if you can buy things with it. Basically all modern money is based on faith, including crypto. Even when it’s based on gold or silver, that’s aren’t actually useful for most people so it’s still made up value worth however much people value that.
Ok, sure, however, fiat currencies are based on the faith that there’s at least one entire nation that you can use your currency in, and is motivated to ensure their currency is worth something, and has some semblance of stability. Crypto is based on the faith that there’s other dumbasses out there that will agree with you that these particular bits hold value for some reason.
And that’s the most beautiful thing about crypto that got lost in all the speculation, shitcoin, scams, and nft bullshit. A currency of the people for the people, but of course, when the pigs came into power they were the same as the old farmers.
It was always a scam. When people were saying these things, that was part of the scam.
There are good uses for the blockchain, just not really with currency.
Keep telling yourself that crypto is a scam with no value, etc… While you loyally and unquestionably use your green paper money covered in pictures of slave masters.
Eh, it’s also the thing that makes it so vulnerable to speculation, shitcoin, scams, and nft bullshit
Not really, I think the vulnerability is the lack of knowledge of the public.
Binary Options and Forex use fiat and they are the exact same brand of scam.
Sure. I’m not disagreeing with that, just that it doesn’t have value. It does. Just because it’s made up doesn’t mean it doesn’t have value, as long as someone is willing to buy it from you.
I don’t like these uses of crypto either. It’s just a really stupid argument to say it doesn’t have value. There are plenty of valid arguments that can be made against it without making something up like that.
Right, and I’m not arguing that cryptocurrency doesn’t have value, just that it’s value is based on a much less solid foundation than the value of fiat currency.
The original comment was. I agree with you.
I’m sorry, but at this point I honestly have more faith in the latter than the former. I just don’t have any faith in America at all.
Ok I’m talking about fiat currency as a concept though, not the USD specifically.
If your point is that fiat currencies are still vulnerable to some instability, then sure, I guess I agree, but fiat currencies are still orders of magnitude more stable than cryptocurrencies.
If a state converted from paper money to crypto, the only discernible differences would be like more computers, more transparency, less middlemen, etc. Crypto is literally just a new (distributed, open) form of accounting.
Sure, and that would make that cryptocurrency a fiat currency.
*Also, it’s not even close to being new, the idea of distributed ledgers has been around for decades at this point.
Serious question: do the Europeans here have more faith in your governments than you do in obsessive internet people?
I can’t answer for anyone but myself, and I’m not European, but I absolutely trust government more than anonymous obsessive Internet people. At least governments are theoretically held in check by those they govern. Internet randos don’t play by anyone’s rules but their own.
The usd has value created by virtue of being backed by the usa government. It is not just faith based.
With the current administration, I’d argue we are definitely in “faith based” money right now.
It was originally based on a gold reserve and then taken off to become a fiat currency. Trump is talking about potentially not paying back debts owned to other governments. Definitely sounds faith based to me, there’s nothing hard backing it.
It’s funny because USA has gone bankrupt several times and most people don’t even know or acknowledge it.
Now they just print paper money and violently force people to use it for stolen oil.
A country, itself, cannot go “bankrupt”.
You wanna know how we can settle debts, for pennies on the dollar, today, right now?
Mint a 10 gajillion USD coin. Now, pay all debts. Now, destroy 10 gajillion USD coin.
See? Impossible to go bankrupt, if you’re the buyer, generator, and seller of something, and there’s always a willing buyer.
That’s completely meaningless and worthless though, especially since that racist empire is literally destroying the planet with its petrol-dollars.
Money does not run on morals.
True, but that isn’t contradictory. The point is value of both of these forms of currency are made up and imaginary. They’re valuable as long as someone is willing to purchase it.
The same is true for gold. People think it has intrinsic value, which is why it’s so easy to scam people with. The value is almost entirely based on people thinking it’s valuable though.
I don’t like crypto-currencies. It “not having value” isn’t the correct argument to use against it though. It’s a pretty stupid one. There are plenty of good arguments that should be used instead.
Government based fiats always has the guarantee that the government will accept them to settle your taxes.
So, as long as the government exists, there’s a buyer for the currency.
Not the case with made up ponzicoins.
The USA government? With the tariffs? And the orange buffoon in charge? If we’re counting that, then we might as well count his “crypto reserve” as backing too.
Or it could be backed by math and economics alone.
Wrong.
Fiat currencies are based on military might, not hopes and dreams.
I don’t think it’s worth the discussion, but comparing a fiat currency like the US dollar with crypto currency is a false equivalence argument. They aren’t even comparable.
You just compared them by calling them both currencies.
I didn’t say they’re equivalent. I said both of them have value that is imaginary. Crypto currencies have value if you can purchase things with them. It just makes you sound dumb to say it doesn’t have value. That’s not the correct argument to make against it.