Many of the cruise-friendly Caribbean countries have camouflage as their military uniform and so it’s illegal to wear it in these countries.
Oh absolutely. I was in one of the countries on that list. Only the rebels and army wore camouflage, and the police would demand you take it off or be arrested. They were serious, the war was not that long ago. It doesn’t matter if you have no other clothes, according to a local they’ll make a tourist go naked rather than allow camouflage.
It doesn’t matter if you have no other clothes
I’m going to report you to the fashion police.
You shouldn’t get on a cruise ever
I am aware of the chicanery cruise lines get up to, as well as the depravity that is commonplace on many American cruise lines. Oh, and emissions.
Apart from that, why should I avoid them?
What more reasons do you need lmao.
Also all of the shit goes into the water iirc
Fair enough on that first point; not sure what the se one one means tho
My phone is borked and i didn’t reread, sorry. I meant that all of the piss and shit just goes in to the water
Someone better tell the billions of sea life to stop pissing and shitting in the water.
Of all the reasons not to use a cruise, this is not one of them.
Wasn’t it a cruise ship that brought covid to the Americas? They’re disease barges, you go on a cruise to catch norovirus, for that fresh exotic kind of blasting out both ends.
They suck.
Also explosive diarrhea
Pretty sure explosive diarrhoea is the opposite of sucking
Can we do this in america please
Let’s be real here. You shouldn’t bring camo with you pretty much anywhere besides hunting.
Not hunting either. High viz unless you want to get shot.
I’ve never understood The South and the military wankfest.
If anything, hunting is one of the worst places to wear camo
Hmm. Everyone around me has guns and wants to shoot a large mammal. I know! I’ll blend into the background so that I only stand out when I move!
That’s why you are required almost everywhere to have some amount of hunter orange on. This makes you visible to humans who can see the color but still not visible to animals who cannot see that tone of orange.
Why isn’t the orange striped like tigers?
Because hunting in or near trees is different than the long grass tigers hunt in. That is why leopards and jaguars have spots instead of stripes.
Orange camouflage is like the common green camouflage pattern but all oranges or with orange mixed in.
Never seen orange mixed in, only solid which prompted my question.
Heres an example.
Solid orange wouldn’t be camo…
Because it speaks to what camouflage is actually for.
This isn’t Metal Gear Solid 3 where you put on the right shit and detection radiuses drop and you can sprint past a guard. Camouflage is about blending in with your background just enough that it buys you more time on the approach or makes it harder to spot you at a distance.
Tigers (orange and white or orange and black stripes) are very much meant to blend into tall grass. They sit in the grass waiting for their prey and their coloring tends to match-ish the tall grass against orange soil and sky of places like the Serengeti.
So how does that work with military camo and the like? Uhm… The effectiveness varies drastically but can best be seen with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Woodland#/media/File:BDUs-forest.jpg. Against the dirt road they stick out like a sore thumb. Against the leafy foliage? Not horrible and you could very much imagine that buying a few meters when approaching in a dense jungle. But if there are too many trees or the foliage is too green (as in that picture), the brown bits stick out a LOT.
Mostly the idea of these camouflage patterns are to minimize detection from the air and to help people hide when they are laying in wait. Which… is why snipers and the like don’t rely on it. They bring tarps that better match the pattern of what they are going to lay against or wear ghillie suits that are basically mesh nets that they can stick leaves and twigs or just appropriately colored fabric into. Hell, one of the “rites of passage” of sniper schools and the like is to literally roll around in the mud in a uniform because that is going to be MUCH more effective than whatever made in china fabric the BDUs are made of. It just loses the ease of distinguishing one side from the other.
Which is why the competent cosplaying hunters don’t really rely on their clothes to hide them while they are walking around and just bring a tarp to hide under while waiting in a blind. Because outside of VERY specific approaches… they are still going to stick out like a sore thumb. ESPECIALLY if they are close enough to take a shot against a deer in a dense forest.
Which gets back to the original question. Why is “blaze orange camouflage not tiger striped”: Because it is a cosplay wank fantasy that lets stores jack up the prices over just buying a high vis vest that cyclists use. And the pattern genuinely does not matter because none of those colors match when you are laying down and hiding, let alone trudging along hunting trails.
Tigers in the Serengeti?
Yeah, dude’s just making shit up or regurgitating an ai hallucination. Orange tiger stripes aren’t blending in with orange dirt either. The herbivores that are a tiger’s prey are reg/green colorblind, which means the orange tiger blends in with the green grasses because the animals can’t distinguish between those colors well.
The rest of the comment isn’t much better. From claiming that a ghillie suit isn’t camouflage (it is). To claiming that a solid color is better camouflage than a camouflage with a decent disruptive pattern. There is good camo and bad camo out there, but Nuxcom_90penis doesn’t seem like the type to see subtly in anything. That’s why I’m up voting you and agreeing with your sentiment here instead of kicking that toxic hornet’s nest.
Yeah…
There is a LOT of FUD online that wearing bright orange makes you invisible to deer. If that were true… just wear a fricking bright orange bunny suit and wait for the deers to start shaving with bowie knives. Although, if one of them reeks of weed and starts talking about Star Wars, RUN AWAY BECAUSE HE IS THE MOST DANGEROUS PERSON IN THE ENTIRE FRANCHISE!!!
I can’t find a good article to confirm if deer even have trouble seeing bright orange. Let’s say it comes across as “grey” for argument’s sake. But they CAN apparently distinguish all the shades of green and brown and that is why you are dressed like John Duty. Which means… they have a giant blob of “grey” moving around? Pretty sure that would stick out…
And for all the stories about how “the deer walked right up to me I was so hidden!”: Homie. Go spend even twenty minutes walking around a park in a mountain town. Deer don’t give a fuck. What startles them on your hunting trips is you talking loudly, reeking of beer and cigarettes, and constantly clanging all your metal knives against your metal pistol and your metal rifle.
Nah. Orange is good. Orange stands out. The rest is just masturbatory cosplay. Up until a couple decades ago (I would guesstimate around the time of the second US-Iraq war), hunters… just wore jeans and work shirts and, if they were “gay”, orange vests. Let alone the centuries of actually hunting for survival prior to that. It is just the Call of Duty generation that insists they need to go on a shopping spree at the 5.11 store before they can go put a gooner hole in Bambi’s mom.
Orange camo still has the shape of the pattern, where the shape is the most important part and the orange isn’t eye catching to deer like it is to humans. Deer do not avoid orange camo, which is why people know it works.
Sometimes hunters do wear reflective orange vests over camo, with the idea that the vest is small enough to not be as noticeable as a full body suit and worth not getting shot.
Deer do not avoid orange camo, which is why people know it works.
Deer do not avoid cars. Or people drinking in their backyards while kids scream and play with each other.
Again, if orange were some magic anti-deer color, you would just wear a solid orange bunny suit like you were about to go out into the desert and have some fun with Malcolm’s Dad.
Also: Again, if any of this bullshit were necessary to “sneak up on the deer” then this continent would have been a giant graveyard as everyone starved because they just didn’t have enough camo and dye. Or, I guess, giant metal boxes with bright lights and loud noise makers?
The reality is that deer are SUPER easy to kill (especially with a high powered rifle…). All of this “We have analyzed the eyes and psychology of deer and figured out a great excuse to stop shooting each other, err, I mean, to sneak up on the deer like, get your lotion ready, Carlos Hathcock!!! No, we don’t care about Pegahmagabow.”
Maybe I am just an old but I remember all the sitcoms where they would have a “hunting episode” and the goober of the group would be wearing all camo and get made fun of. Hell, I want to say there was an episode of Frasier where they go to the cabin and Niles shows up after getting fleeced by a local shop and… he looked a lot like the modern day cosplayer-err, hunter. Not to mention having grown up in the kind of town where Real Men drive a few hours away during deer season to prove they are Men by killing a few deer and talking about how difficult it was.
Deer do not avoid cars.
They often freeze when blinded by headlights, but they sure as shit avoid cars the vast majority of the time.
Or people drinking in their backyards while kids scream and play with each other.
Yes, they do avoid noisy people.
You sound like someone who has never interacted with deer in the wild, which is actually pretty difficult since they actively avoid people. You also have to hit a fairly small area on the deer to kill it, and hitting that is actually not easy at longer ranges.
I know both from interacting with deer and target shooting with deer hunters, although I chose not to actually participate in hunting.
It really depends a bit on where you are
I live in a suburban area with a ton of deer. Around here they’re pretty damn used to people, cars, etc. not that they won’t get spooked if you start walking towards them, but if you’re being chill they’ll hang around pretty damn close to you.
One time I was hunting, walking around through the woods near me with my bow, turned a corner around some tall brush and there were 3 does standing maybe about 15ft from me. I didn’t have a doe tag so I just stood there and watched. They saw me, sized me up for a minute, then went back to doing deer stuff right in front of me. It was getting late and I was about ready to pack it in so I even talked to them a little, joking that they should go get their boyfriends for me, they didn’t give a fuck.
I work nights, damn near every night on my lunch break, there’s a handful of deer hanging around outside our lunch room, I eat outside when it’s nice, the deer don’t mind me being out there, chatting with my coworkers. Few weeks back I was out there while there were some fireworks going off nearby, the deer didn’t mind that one bit either (though the dogs in the nearby neighborhood were not a fan, the deer were more concerned, though still not too bothered, about the barking than the explosions going off overhead)
My commute is along some fairly major roads. There’s almost no traffic when I’m commuting, but there’s always going to be at least a car or two driving by every few minutes. Those roads are practically lined with deer.
If I don’t see at least a dozen deer on any given day while just going about my business it’s kind of weird.
But when I go camping and hiking in more rural/wooded areas, the deer are a lot more skittish, and I rarely see them even though I know the woods have to be teeming with them, there’s no shortage of droppings, rubs, shed antlers, etc. but the deer aren’t hanging around if they catch a whiff of you.
Dude… just once, try actually going into The Forest without being strapped like you are storming Fallujah. Deer will gladly walk along trails and it is not at all uncommon to have to yell at your belayer to pay attention because they got distracted by Bambi walking around. Or spend some time in a town that borders a wooded area and you’ll see plenty of deer just wandering around backyards or slowly walking through the streets.
Similarly, as a youth I was dragged along on a few hunting trips back in the day where you just dressed for the weather rather than figuring out what military you want to cosplay as. And it was NEVER hard to find a deer. That is WHY so many counties/regions have license requirements and point systems. Hell, a memory that is forever burned into my skull because of how fucked and hysterical it was is my ex’s father gutting the deer he just shot while two others walk up to us and just chill.
Understand that the vast majority of modern day hunters are those two guys from (ugh) South Park and are constantly making up excuses and self aggrandizing themselves. They think they are going to war and are all super hardcore snipers and would wear ghillie suits if (pretend I know another tacticool brand than 5.11) sold them at the mall. And understand that much of the world has a long time dependency on hunting for survival. And I am pretty sure the cowboys who made bison all but extinct weren’t all dying their clothes multiple shades of brown and painting their faces every time they were hungry.
I’m not a hunter, I’ve never shot a dear and I don’t think I ever will. I do go hiking though.
Let’s say it comes across as “grey” for argument’s sake. But they CAN apparently distinguish all the shades of green and brown and that is why you are dressed like John Duty. Which means… they have a giant blob of “grey” moving around? Pretty sure that would stick out…
When you hear the term “red-green color blindness”, do you think that red and green appear grey to those people while they can still see orange, yellow, and blue the same as everyone else? And that they go through their lives with these super high contrast grey objects everywhere?
That’s not how eyes work. Color blindness means an inability to distinguish between shades of colors, not that they have some sort of selective filters that block those colors out, turn objects of that color invisible, or convert them to grey.
Homie. Go spend even twenty minutes walking around a park in a mountain town. Deer don’t give a fuck.
You think this because you live in a suburb where people feed them, “in a park”, or “bordering a forested area”. No unconditioned wild animal in the world, except maybe things that live on tiny islands with no predators, is chill with an unknown human sized animal standing next to it.
When I hike I sometimes see deer as close as a hundred feet or so away, but if one started walking towards me I would consider that behavior so far out of the ken that I might think it has rabies or wasting disease.
Understand that I’m not even arguing that shooting a deer is some sort of crazy achievement.
That’s not how eyes work. Color blindness means an inability to distinguish between shades of colors, not that they have some sort of selective filters that block those colors out, turn objects of that color invisible, or convert them to grey.
Yes. Explaining how color blindness works to people who think an orange vest combined with green and brown camo is going to be an invisibility cloak is… an even bigger undertaking than explaining how camouflage works in the first place. Hence “grey”
Explaining what a Red/Green person sees is… literally like explaining sight to the blind. Err, blindness to the sighted? Whatever, it is that.
Hence, making the simple assumption rather than doing a deep dive on what we believe deer can actually see (got bored and did some wikipedia trawling and chatgpt corroborating. Allegedly they can distinguish blue, but most greens and browns and oranges all look like “green”). So the original statement of “Camouflage still matters while you have a giant orange safety vest on” is patently moronic no matter how you spin it and can ONLY make sense if orange is “invisible” (which it obviously isn’t) and it is, at best, no different than wearing a solid color shirt… at which point why do you need camo pattern pants?
From there, the ante was upped to insist people need to go buy clothes that look like Gritty nutted all over them that incorporate the orange into the camo pattern itself. If you get the colors right? Yeah, that is theoretically comparable to green/brown camo. Which would actually work IF camouflage actually served a purpose against deer to begin with (outside of MAYBE covering a blind with a tarp, as I mentioned in a different branch). Which gets back to the undertaking of explaining how camouflage even works and that it isn’t like Metal Gear Solid 3. The blob of broken up colors moving across a solid-ish tree is still going to be very noticeable. Let alone the one standing up straight and walking around on hunting trails.
You think this because you live in a suburb where people feed them, “in a park”, or “bordering a forested area”. No unconditioned wild animal in the world, except maybe things that live on tiny islands with no predators, is chill with an unknown human sized animal standing next to it.
When I hike I sometimes see deer as close as a hundred feet or so away, but if one started walking towards me I would consider that behavior so far out of the ken that I might think it has rabies or wasting disease.
Yes, I live in a town with a big animal problem. I also spend probably cumulatively weeks out of the year on both hiking trails and camping well off the trails.
Deer walking up to you when you are stopping for lunch is not common but it also isn’t super uncommon if you are off the major trails. It is almost a horse shoe effect where you have the deer who are totally used to humans and the deer who have so little concept of them that they get curious and… deer are REAL stupid. Ironically, the average area zoned for hunting is a lot closer to the former since there are jackasses swarming around and leaving food everywhere broken up by sudden bangs and corpse defiling.
But a deer not caring that you are within 100 meters (honestly, more like 10-30…) which is the perfect range to aim and heroically shoot it? Yeah, that is 100% believable anywhere along that horseshoe.
The point was more “I am so invisible the deer walked up to me”, which is a common refrain when you see articles or discussions on this, is idiocy based in ignorance of the animals that these brave men and women of the muja-err, hunters constantly “harvest”.
Understand that I’m not even arguing that shooting a deer is some sort of crazy achievement.
And on that we both agree. Like I said, the average hunter is just those two guys from south park who screamed “They’re coming right for us” as an excuse to shoot whatever they want. Everything else is the same gun nut “if you buy this you will be unstoppable and your dick will get bigger”.
But, to loop back around to the original point before I apparently angered 5.11’s community manager: Wearing “human” camo while hunting is idiotic because you are literally making yourself harder to see for the people with guns. Wearing “deer” camo is idiotic for other reasons but… is still way better than rocking the flecktarn?
People literally hunt in orange bunny suits, just like you’re suggesting. It’s regulation in several states, especially the more densely populated states. A lot of that “camo” you see is just because people like to wear it in public to advertise that they’re outdoorsy people. Even states that allow camo hunting gear require a considerable percentage of it to be orange, which is where you get the mixed orange/camo patterns from. Either that or people wear orange vests over their camo, but the solid orange stuff is usually cheaper so most hunters just wear that.
We know deer can’t see blaze orange because we’ve dissected their eyes, not because of whatever call of duty internally strawman you’re very mad at.
https://deerassociation.com/can-deer-see-blaze-orange/
As for why hunters haven’t worn orange until recent history, remember that producing whatever color you want cheaply, on demand, and at scale is a relatively modern thing. We produce a lot of colors that simply don’t exist in nature these days.
That depends on what you’re hunting. Whitetail deer? The deer use scent and hearing much more than visual. Birds? They can see more colors than us and camouflage is important.
Dick Cheney? Is that you? Homie? You never had to even make an excuse.
Which gets back to “why do you want to be hard to spot when people around you have guns”. Unless we are now apparently saying that birds can see orange and actively ignore it like in the other branch.
I realize you’re speaking from a position of ignorance, but yes birds can see orange. Even the states I checked nearby have an exception specific for waterfowl. It’s also the reason their hunting seasons don’t overlap.
From the Wisconsin DNR:
When and where a firearm deer season (listed on page 3) is in progress, it is illegal to hunt any game, except waterfowl, unless at least 50% of the hunter’s outer clothing above the waist is colored blaze orange or fluorescent pink.
This thread is hilarious. People acting like experts about shit they know nothing about. I appreciate you engaging with these morons so I don’t have to.
Yeah, it’s a confidently incorrect situation for sure. That said, I agree with it being weird to wear camouflage if you’re not in the military or hunting. It’s kind of a poser thing to do. Like wearing a Harley Davidson shirt and not having a motorcycle.
Usually people wear blaze orange on top of camo.
I mean it’s kind of a fun pattern in streetwear. I like mashing it up with queer or androgynous stuff 🤷♂️
Edit: can anyone tell me why I’m being downvoted? I don’t really care but it’s clear some people really strongly disagree with me and I’m not entirely sure why…
People disagree because it’s still an abstraction of camo. Wearing it in the first place came from people fawning over militarism.
I actually think it can work with a queer look in one of two ways, so you are likely fine: Either it’s effectively teasing the pro authoritarian militarism camo types, or it’s a radical anarchy armed rebel look, which without praxis is really just the former look again. Either way these are fine.
Another reason maybe you’ve been downvoted is that people loathe the deep abstraction of modern, or rather postmoderm society. Camo was made for soldiers > Camo was worn by patriotic civilians simulating the soldier aesthetic > particularly under the Bush administration, it became less a symbol of soldiers, and more a symbol of patriots. Patriotism is nationalism.
Today when most of us camo in the military cosplaying way, we think ‘nationalist’. When we see a person in a little bit of camo, perhaps just some came shorts and a regular t-shirt, we think either ‘nationalist’, ‘okay with nationalism’ or ‘ignorant of nationalism’.
So when most people see someone in a blended queer and camo look, they probably assume one of three things: ‘ignorant of nationalism’, ‘critical of nationalism in a rebellious manner’ or ‘pro nationalist queer’. Of course one of these is fine, but one is very bad.
Thank you for explaining your perspective.
I do think there should be room for playing with the aesthetics that make up our world without them always being a political or societal critique though.
Everything that exists was made by people and comes with the baggage of having been crafted by things as messy as we are. I think there should be room to play and enjoy how your clothe yourself even if it doesn’t fit into a narrative about your beliefs.
Its wonderful when it does, but given that it’s a creative enterprise basically every human will participate in for tens of thousands of reps over the span of your life, I think looking at someone’s clothes and making a snap judgement on who they can be or what they can stand for because of what “playing with aesthetic” looks like for them is a bit silly
We all draw lines, some imagery is intended to convey cruel meaning- I’m not about to play symbols designed to represent the oppression of certain people. But short of when people intentionally advertise a certain world view (with pride flags or swasticas or punk patches or various other ideological symbols intended to communicate who you are and what you stand for) it seems much more productive to judge people for the ideas they advocate and the impact they have on the world around them than the prints they think are fun for clothes.
To me this feels like a similar fascet of hyper abstraction rather than engaging with substance 🤷
They make for good work pants, theyre tough and light with plenty of pocket space
Fuck me I guess lol
What you’re describing are cargo pants. They come in non-camo colors. Often for much cheaper.
The non-camo versions are even the ceremonial garb of the 90s kid if you pair it with a shitty plaid shirt.
K
Im not saying go spend a bunch on replacing your pants, mine were hand-me-downs.
I don’t really understand why yall give a shit about this in day to day circumstances
Why Cruise Ships Ban Camouflage
The camouflage ban is not a matter of dress code, where the nautical sea-dogs in their pristine ship’s whites turn their noses up at certain sartorial choices. It’s actually much more practical.
In a lot of countries, particularly in some cruise-friendly areas like the Caribbean, wearing camouflage is illegal as a civilian because it’s part of a military uniform. Think of it as being akin to impersonating a police officer; it’s really not the kind of confusion—or trouble—you want to get into on vacation. Even camo patterns with non-traditional colors beyond the usual brown and green are not allowed.
Yes, but, well, they wouldn’t see me if I were to wear camouflage, so it would be a non-issue. /s
<Proceeds to dress as The Sea>
Its not the thread and would actually look okay (or, at least, not like you are a cosplaying goober) as clothing but
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_camouflage
It speaks to the actual role of camouflage as breaking up silhouettes. Which… if you are on the open sea is a major problem because there is nothing to blend into. Hence stuff like dazzle that is more about making it hard to distinguish exactly what kind of ship you are, what your direction is, or what your speed is. And it is genuinely wild how effective it was. Some of the more realistic WW1/2 naval milsims implement it and it makes you understand just how important radar/sonar actually was when you are struggling to make a firing solution for your torpedoes against what MIGHT be a destroyer.
It’s ironic that they chose an example of dazzle for the article’s main photo since it’s purpose isn’t to concealn disguise, or blend in so much as make ranging difficult. Not looking to split hairs with semantics. I just think it’s cool.
I mean… if you actually read the article (or even the comment you are replying to…) you’ll see it isn’t ironic in the slightest.
Camouflage from other ships really isn’t a thing. You can paint your ship grey or blue but that still stands out against the horizon at sea probably 20 hours a day. And is worse than useless if you are near a shoreline.
Odds get a lot better against aerial spotters (e.g. planes) but that also has mostly been rendered pointless in an era of radar since you anti-radar paint is VERY expensive and you don’t have many options to add the angles that actually make the biggest difference for stealth purposes.
Which is why Dazzle et al were generally the popular approach. You were going to see the ship no matter what, so the point is to make it as hard to get actionable data out of that visual contact as possible. And… once radar and sonar took over there wasn’t even much point to that.
Point of order, wearing camo pattern on anything other than military/hunting attire just looks bad.
If you’re on a cruise and you want your clothes to look busy, why not try a floral print?
tropical camo
Me running around with
on saying “I’m a ghost ghost ghost…”I’m going to call it that now, and probably seem really clever and funny at the next luau-themed party I attend. Then people will like me.
Camo, generally on military styled clothes, is a super fun print in street wear. I really like puting it together with androgynous or queer looking stuff 🤷♂️
Edit: can anyone tell me why I’m being downvoted? I don’t really care but it’s clear some people really strongly disagree with me and I’m not entirely sure why…
How about Camo Bermuda, is that part of their military as well?
Tbf, if you’re on a cruise ship and it docks at Zimbabwe, then worse mistakes have been made than your choice of outfit.
Where are those island guys hiding that they need camo as a uniform? They should wear tan pants and blue shirts so they blend in with the beach and horizon.
TIL you shouldn’t bring camouflage
on a cruiseto any place in which you do not need to be concealed.In my experience you don’t even need camo to blend in. I’m a self-proclaimed military autist and my entire wardrobe is earth tones. That alone is enough to startle people on the trails when they’re not looking ahead and I suddenly appear in front of them on my bike. Camo obviously helps, but it’s not about perfectly blending in - it’s about not standing out. When I spot people in the woods it’s always because of a pale face or hands, or some brightly colored or white piece of clothing. Black stands out a lot too, but anything gray, brown, or green usually disappears into the background unless you’re staring right at it.
