Am I just missing where they claim that? From the conclusion:
Altering the palatability of this feed to rodents through the addition of capsaicin may greatly enhance traditional methods of increasing poison bait acceptance on poultry operations
That they avoid the taste has nothing inherently to do with the ‘pain’ experienced as a result of consuming it - in the preceding section they discuss other strategies to increase bait acceptance, including adding rodenticide to preferred bait foods. That rodents have taste preferences isn’t really in question, that they have a pain response to consuming capsaicin is.
The question was never if subcutaneous injections of capsaicin produce a pain reaction, nor how the effects of neonatal exposure to capsaicin effect the development of a rats life (even if there are impacts on the sensitivity of a response in TRPV1 as a result, your second link pretty clearly establishes that that is not a strong indicator of pain response to capsaicin in rodents, though it doesn’t go on to establish specifics thereof). Neither of those have to do with the consumption of capsaicin, though the second article is pretty interesting! It doesn’t establish a relationship between baseline “rodents” and TRPV1 response though, nor does it make any claims about severity of response or exposure sensitivity (which are not the goals of the paper), but that may be because the only english copy I can find of the article is a fairly abbreviated version of the full chinese text (and I uh… do not read written chinese very well at all, let alone discussions of technical biology).
Okay, I’m starting to question if you’re reading the articles you’re bringing out here?
with the proportion of each reaction among disgust reactions similar to that induced by bitter and sour stimuli
First paper states in the abstract that it isn’t measuring a pain response, the paper goes on to clarify that (and has some pretty horrifying descriptions of the surgical procedure…) and is explicit that any response is based on mouse behavior, making no attempt to compare it to human reactions (because that is a really tricky question to answer in a rigorous manner, lets be real)
The second is studying the LD-50 of capsaicin - and yeah I bet they had a pain response, since they were given so much of it some of them died of stomach ulcers. It does not at any point discuss the pain response from consuming it, beyond that they died, only the symptoms after consumption.
These are both fundamentally irrelevant to the topic at hand.
By this researcher they do feel the “pain” from it:
capsaicin as a rodent aversion agent
Am I just missing where they claim that? From the conclusion:
That they avoid the taste has nothing inherently to do with the ‘pain’ experienced as a result of consuming it - in the preceding section they discuss other strategies to increase bait acceptance, including adding rodenticide to preferred bait foods. That rodents have taste preferences isn’t really in question, that they have a pain response to consuming capsaicin is.
here is test that uses pain caused by capsicin to test local anesthesia:
orofacial capsaicin test in rats
Does this prove that capsicium causes pain?
Edit some more research regarding the rodents:
Tree shrews can tolerate hot peppers:
Changes in TRPV1-Mediated Physiological Function in Rats Systemically Treated With Capsaicin on the Neonate
The question was never if subcutaneous injections of capsaicin produce a pain reaction, nor how the effects of neonatal exposure to capsaicin effect the development of a rats life (even if there are impacts on the sensitivity of a response in TRPV1 as a result, your second link pretty clearly establishes that that is not a strong indicator of pain response to capsaicin in rodents, though it doesn’t go on to establish specifics thereof). Neither of those have to do with the consumption of capsaicin, though the second article is pretty interesting! It doesn’t establish a relationship between baseline “rodents” and TRPV1 response though, nor does it make any claims about severity of response or exposure sensitivity (which are not the goals of the paper), but that may be because the only english copy I can find of the article is a fairly abbreviated version of the full chinese text (and I uh… do not read written chinese very well at all, let alone discussions of technical biology).
Combination of these two should show you that mice react similarly to human reactions to oral ingestion of capsicin:
Innate liking and disgust reactions elicited by intraoral capsaicin in male mice
Acute oral toxicity of capsaicin in mice
Okay, I’m starting to question if you’re reading the articles you’re bringing out here?
First paper states in the abstract that it isn’t measuring a pain response, the paper goes on to clarify that (and has some pretty horrifying descriptions of the surgical procedure…) and is explicit that any response is based on mouse behavior, making no attempt to compare it to human reactions (because that is a really tricky question to answer in a rigorous manner, lets be real)
The second is studying the LD-50 of capsaicin - and yeah I bet they had a pain response, since they were given so much of it some of them died of stomach ulcers. It does not at any point discuss the pain response from consuming it, beyond that they died, only the symptoms after consumption.
These are both fundamentally irrelevant to the topic at hand.